BIOS update to support Ryzen 3700x? Helios 500 question

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Answers

  • Jashj
    Jashj Member Posts: 2 New User
    Same boat as everyone voicing support for a bios update for ryzen 3.
  • xapim
    xapim ACE Posts: 7,240 Pathfinder
    As i stated already in this thread theres a high probability that it wont happen


    https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/11532543

    UserBenchmarks: Game 43%, Desk 61%, Work 40%
    CPU: Intel Core i5-7300HQ - 63.5%
    GPU: Nvidia GTX 1050-Ti (Mobile) - 41.9%
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    RAM: Kingston HyperX DDR4 2666 C15 2x16GB - 76.8%
    MBD: Acer Predator G3-572

    I'm not an Acer employee. (just here to help in the best way i can)
    If my answer fixed you issue please accept it for any other users who search for it would find it quickly thanks :)
    If you want to learn more about undervolting/optimizing windows join the Predator fb group and youtube channel:

    Owner/Admin (HOTEL HERO/Red-Sand/Opoka Opoka)
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/PredatorHelios300
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    Acer support:
    https://www.acer.com/ac/en/US/content/service-contact
    http://www.acer.com/worldwide/support/  


  • Khelgar
    Khelgar Member Posts: 44 Devotee WiFi Icon
    C'mon Acer, you could be gaining many loyal customers here by making this laptop support the newer Ryzens as it should have as a proper desktop replacer. Update it!
  • 1GOG
    1GOG Member Posts: 11

    Tinkerer
    Acer!!! Will be nice to see new BIOS update! We all hoping that you can make this! 
  • caito
    caito Member Posts: 11

    Tinkerer
    @Acer this would be a tremendous marketing point for sales of your products to truly offer upgradability in lieu of intentionally hindering upgradability which doesnt fair well with your current customer base
  • BurnsXL
    BurnsXL Member Posts: 35 Devotee WiFi Icon
    edited July 2019
    Hey I just stumbled upon this - does this have any application here?
    EDIT - AMD direct link - https://www.amd.com/en/support/kb/faq/pa-100#faq-Workarounds

    https://www.extremetech.com/computing/295027-amd-will-provide-a-free-temporary-uefi-upgrade-kit-for-ryzen-3000-motherboard-updates

    Sounds like AMD itself will do the BIOS update if you have a MoBo that won't boot with an upgraded CPU? Looks like you've gotten contact them directly and mail a picture, but - I think this is what we need? 
  • NiteNinja
    NiteNinja Member Posts: 50 Devotee WiFi Icon
    the upgrade kit is designed for people who lets say bought a used motherboard and a ryzen 3000 processor, or by some chance their new motherboard doesn't have the proper bios and you bought a ryzen 3000 series processor. They ship you out a compatible 2000 series processor, More likely an Athlon has very low yield, just enough so you can go on to your motherboard manufacturers website and download the proper BIOS that you need.
  • BurnsXL
    BurnsXL Member Posts: 35 Devotee WiFi Icon
    edited July 2019
    Are you sure? That's not exactly what takeaway is after reading the AMD page in general...looks like they're wanting to know about ANY AM4 motherboard that isn't supporting the next-gen Ryzen. You are correct in that they send you an AMD Athlon 200GE or something to boot it, but I get the impression that this is ACTUALLY about wanting to find out which of their partners aren't fully supporting the upgrade path via this (admittedly indirect) method. 

    Here is the part I think is most interesting, as it sounds like either Acer or AMD will be obligated to do something:

    USB BIOS Flashback

    Select motherboards are designed to support “USB BIOS Flashback,” which allows for BIOS updates from a flash drive—even if the current BIOS on the motherboard does not have the software code to boot a new processor. Some motherboards can even update the BIOS when there’s no CPU in the socket at all. Such motherboards feature special hardware to enable USB BIOS Flashback, and every manufacturer has a unique procedure to execute USB BIOS Flashback. Customers are encouraged to determine if their motherboard supports USB BIOS Flashback and, if yes, follow the update steps described in the motherboard’s support documentation.

    BACK TO TOP

    Short Term Processor Loan Boot Kit

    AMD will offer affected and qualified users (as described below) an AMD Athlon 200GE Processor, including thermal solution, for short-term use ("boot kit") to perform the BIOS update on their motherboard.

    This short-term processor loan or boot kit is offered through AMD warranty services and is available only for qualified users that:

    1. Have made a valid purchase of a 3rd Gen Ryzen™ Desktop Processor and;
    2. Are unable to boot that processor because the user’s current X470/B450 BIOS must be upgraded first.

    This service is free of charge with the following condition:

    Once you have submitted your claim for a processor loan boot kit, AMD will require pictures of your 3rd  Gen Ryzen™ Desktop Processor and AMD Socket AM4 400 Series motherboard, which clearly shows the model numbers and unique serial numbers as well as a copy of the purchase invoice(s) to authorize the request. Additionally, a summary or copy of communication with the motherboard manufacturer is requested to indicate why support from the Original Design Manufacturer (ODM) is not suitable.

    Once the RMA request is approved, the AMD Athlon 200GE processor will be sent with pre-paid return shipping. The processor is provided as a temporary loan to you for the sole purpose of updating the BIOS and must be returned within 10 business days of receipt. It is not necessary to return the provided thermal solution.

    To obtain the boot kit, please carefully follow these instructions:

    1. Go to the AMD online warranty claims page: https://www.amd.com/en/support/kb/warranty-information/rma-form
    2. Fill in your full contact and product details (3rd Gen Ryzen Processor OPN number and serial number)
    3. In the Problem Description field enter "Boot kit Required" (without quotes)

    NOTE: The product must be a valid AMD processor with authentic OPN and serial number.

    Once the claim is received and approved, confirmation details and boot kit instructions will be provided in a follow up email.


  • NiteNinja
    NiteNinja Member Posts: 50 Devotee WiFi Icon
    In other words:
    If you got a Ryzen 3rd gen processor and you have no way to update the BIOS on your 3xx/4xx motherboard, well send you a cheapo processor to upgrade your BIOS with. 

    "The processor is provided as a temporary loan to you for the sole purpose of updating the BIOS and must be returned within 10 business days of receipt."

    However the line you're inquiring about...
    "Additionally, a summary or copy of communication with the motherboard manufacturer is requested to indicate why support from the Original Design Manufacturer (ODM) is not suitable."
    ...is if you contacted your motherboard manufacturer for help and they told you to go to hell and update it yourself, or charge you a stupid fee to update it. This unfortunately doesn't mean if there is no BIOS at all supporting a 3rd Gen processor, just if the company won't update it for you and you have no way to update it yourself.

    Also this laptop doesn't support BIOS flashback, so side-loading unauthorized BIOS' can only be done at the chip level unfortunately.

    Best we can do is wait and see what Acer does.
  • BurnsXL
    BurnsXL Member Posts: 35 Devotee WiFi Icon
    We'll see - AMD is being super helpful so far and says they'll be able to help me once I submit what they ask for.

    WHICH - just had confirmation that Acer is not supporting next-gen CPU upgrades and is not going to as well. Can post the screenshots but I hope you'll just take my word. This rep specifically understood what I was asking and spent about 15min doing research. 

    Will let you know what AMD says, but it does seem like they're willing to figure something out once they confirm that Acer did not support the upgrade path
  • vanadium
    vanadium Member Posts: 68 Devotee WiFi Icon
    For some interested: I have the 8750h version with a modded bios (hidden advanced bios menu unlocked). I removed the factory 2x8GB 2400Mhz and replaced it by HyperX Impact 2x16GB 3200Mhz. It runs flawlessly at 3200Mhz even with default RAM settings, which suggest this RAM would run at this speed even with non-modded bios.

    Geekbench result:

    Thanks to -200mV undervolt, I could make the best multi-core score of all Helios 500:

    Maybe someone from bios-mods could include the latest AGESA so the bios would support one of the latest Ryzen 3xxx?
    MrTortue
  • NiteNinja
    NiteNinja Member Posts: 50 Devotee WiFi Icon
    That's the forum I used to get the modified bios for my Asus gl702zc.

    Unfortunately the ryzen 2700 in this laptop is pretty picky on memory. I tried throwing in another 16 GB g skill, and my system became unstable. But that's Ryzen second gen in a nutshell anyway. The Intel counterpart accepts much faster memory.

    That would just be another benefit of being able to use the 3rd gen ryzen processor, is the better memory support.
  • BurnsXL
    BurnsXL Member Posts: 35 Devotee WiFi Icon
    So AMD is fully aware of the situation (has to be, because they've read it all) and they've still approved me for a BIOS update kit; we'll see if it works, but I'm pretty sure they know what they're doing? 

    Interesting about the RAM, I added another 16gb in to it and it works at 2666 but I didn't try anything faster. 
  • kingmetal
    kingmetal Member Posts: 17 Troubleshooter

    BurnsXL said:
    So AMD is fully aware of the situation (has to be, because they've read it all) and they've still approved me for a BIOS update kit; we'll see if it works, but I'm pretty sure they know what they're doing? 

    Interesting about the RAM, I added another 16gb in to it and it works at 2666 but I didn't try anything faster. 
    Thanks for trying. I'm not sure that you will get any value out of the bootkit, as they are a loaner processor that is designed to allow you to purchase an older generation processor and a newer generation motherboard so you can install a manufacturer supplied BIOS update (not provided in the kit). Seems unlikely to me that AMD would provide some kind of generic BIOS that would be universally compatible with all systems - but I suppose the only way to find out is to try!
  • Nottheseapples
    Nottheseapples Member Posts: 6

    Tinkerer
    Bumping for awesomenesskingmetal said:

    BurnsXL said:
    So AMD is fully aware of the situation (has to be, because they've read it all) and they've still approved me for a BIOS update kit; we'll see if it works, but I'm pretty sure they know what they're doing? 

    Interesting about the RAM, I added another 16gb in to it and it works at 2666 but I didn't try anything faster. 
    Thanks for trying. I'm not sure that you will get any value out of the bootkit, as they are a loaner processor that is designed to allow you to purchase an older generation processor and a newer generation motherboard so you can install a manufacturer supplied BIOS update (not provided in the kit). Seems unlikely to me that AMD would provide some kind of generic BIOS that would be universally compatible with all systems - but I suppose the only way to find out is to try!
    I
  • Jashj
    Jashj Member Posts: 2 New User
    BurnsXL said:
    Hey I just stumbled upon this - does this have any application here?
    EDIT - AMD direct link - https://www.amd.com/en/support/kb/faq/pa-100#faq-Workarounds

    https://www.extremetech.com/computing/295027-amd-will-provide-a-free-temporary-uefi-upgrade-kit-for-ryzen-3000-motherboard-updates

    Sounds like AMD itself will do the BIOS update if you have a MoBo that won't boot with an upgraded CPU? Looks like you've gotten contact them directly and mail a picture, but - I think this is what we need? 
    Based on this verbiage, I'd agree that it sounds that AMD may push for additional compatibility.  I guess we'll see.  Thanks for the work!  My notebook was backordered until August 16, so I'll certainly be trying for one as well once it gets delivered.
  • caito
    caito Member Posts: 11

    Tinkerer
    @BurnsXL
    This sounds INCREDIBLY promising, will continue to keep fingers crossed for you
    as I would also very much like to follow the exact same upgrade path you are attempting
    Could you kindly keep us posted along the way of your experience?
    Thanks so much!
    Carl
  • bobzdar
    bobzdar Member Posts: 42 Devotee WiFi Icon
    BurnsXL said:
    So AMD is fully aware of the situation (has to be, because they've read it all) and they've still approved me for a BIOS update kit; we'll see if it works, but I'm pretty sure they know what they're doing? 

    Interesting about the RAM, I added another 16gb in to it and it works at 2666 but I didn't try anything faster. 
    Any update?  I'm probably picking up a 3700X tonight, and I'd rather put it in the Predator than my mITX system (which has bios support).  I may end up selling the Helios and just using the mITX system if that's the case, unfortunately.
  • Nottheseapples
    Nottheseapples Member Posts: 6

    Tinkerer
    Not gonna let this die... 🙃

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