Helios 300 PH317-53-72P5 rtx 2060 fan stopping

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Answers

  • belik
    belik Member Posts: 397 Seasoned Practitioner WiFi Icon
    Sure @Jhjh6980
    And btw profiles for PH317-53 and my PH315-52 are the same
  • jakesu11y
    jakesu11y Member Posts: 80 Fixer WiFi Icon
    @belik if you can pull this off that would be awesome. I'd love to idle my machine at ~1000 rpms. It's so strange Acer doesn't allow fan curves and stuff that make sense. 

    Even if you go manual you cant turn them down low. I'm always idling at 1980rpms cpu and 2460rpm gpu. Very frustrating. 
  • Mahoney
    Mahoney Member Posts: 2 New User
    @belik Can you post your current NBFC config somewhere? Pretty please, with sugar on top? I could really use this for my PH317, even if it's WIP.

    Currently, I have to actually open the laptop and unplug the fans to stop them for normal use (I limit max CPU frequency to about 60-80% during my everyday use, and it allows me to use it for browsing\etc with just passive cooling and under 30-50 degrees, while keeping my sanity). But it would be great to be able to stop\start the fans using software instead. Controlling the curve would be even better, but at this point even just being able to stop\start the fans would be a huge improvement.
     

  • Jhjh6980
    Jhjh6980 Member Posts: 78 Devotee WiFi Icon
    edited January 2020
    belik said:
    Well there is one showstopper here and am not sure that it will be passed so I am going to post what we have now so that those findings won’t vanish
    I asked the question to moderator of this community hopefully he will forward it to Acer engineer and get feedback. Without this answer NBFC will not work as it should.

    Before you start, be aware that you are responsible for PC temperatures coz if you set fans to constant speed system wont be able to take control over

    Also if anything goes wrong, don’t worry. You need to reset bios and EC (embedded controller responsible for fan control), to do it turn the PC off and then press power button for 12 seconds 

     Here is the fan curve table system uses to control fans

     
    There is also must be one record in the beginning with 21C, below 21C fans have 0 rpm

    Unfortunately we don’t know where this table stored in, we can’t find it neither in bios or EC so we can’t change this table
    And what our approach is that we overwrite value in CPU temperature register so EC thinks that temperature is different and set fans according to the table above  =)
    But this is a register used only by PredatorSense so wrong temperature will be reported only in PredatorSense. Other apps like hwinfo, aida64, Intel xtu, NBFCetc use another sensor and you can check it there

    So here is the NBFC profile it’s not even mine and you can adjust it as you want and maybe even create custom fan curve. It suites for PH315-52 and PH317-53
    https://www104.zippyshare.com/v/3PgmW8i6/file.html

    CPU temp sensor is 219 register, GPU 221
    CPU fan read sensor 112 register, GPU 92 

    The main issue of this method is that we both, system and NBFC, try to overwrite the same register and struggling for that. So this method is not reliable and only for testing purpose. 
    For proper use we need to switch EC to manual mode and for that we must know where this register is, this is the question I wait the answer for.


    Could you make a tutorial on YouTube?
    if you disable notebookfancrontrol , can you return to the normal profile?
  • belik
    belik Member Posts: 397 Seasoned Practitioner WiFi Icon
    edited January 2020
    @Jhjh6980
    Download and install app ver.1.6.3. from here
    https://github.com/hirschmann/nbfc/releases
    then go to folder c:\program files 86\notebook fan control
    run config exe and open menu import, select xml profile from the archive
    then run notebook fan control exe, choose new profile and apply
    then you will have an icon in the tray, clicking on it you can adjust fan speed slider 
    that’s all  :)

    yes when disabling it all must revert to default with normal control by the system, temperatures in PredatorSense must became real
    if not, reset your EC

  • Mahoney
    Mahoney Member Posts: 2 New User
    @belik This is awesome - thanks a lot! I've set Fan Control to Auto in PredatorSense, installed NBFC and added that config - and it works! This is a huge relief, really. Now I can actually disable fans without unplugging them from the board - which is much more convenient and safe.

    I use HWiNFO to display sensors data in system tray, and use a power plan with limited max CPU frequency most of the time, so passive cooling makes a lot of sense for me (e.g. my current CPU temp is just 34 degrees Celsius, with fans disabled - and it stays about the same while I use web browser, text processor, watch videos, etc) and only need to use high-performance plan while playing some games (then I just set fans to either auto or to max, depending on a game).

    I agree, though - having a proper way to set the fan speed instead of overwriting the temp data would be great. But even having just this workaround is already a huge improvement, at least in my quality of life. Thanks again!


  • Jhjh6980
    Jhjh6980 Member Posts: 78 Devotee WiFi Icon
    belik said:
    @Jhjh6980
    Download and install app ver.1.6.3. from here
    https://github.com/hirschmann/nbfc/releases
    then go to folder c:\program files 86\notebook fan control
    run config exe and open menu import, select xml profile from the archive
    then run notebook fan control exe, choose new profile and apply
    then you will have an icon in the tray, clicking on it you can adjust fan speed slider 
    that’s all  :)

    yes when disabling it all must revert to default with normal control by the system, temperatures in PredatorSense must became real
    if not, reset your EC

    thanks belik
    it's work perfectly
  • Tikisin
    Tikisin Member Posts: 22 Networker
    I'm also using it and it works great.
    Thanks a lot. 
  • belik
    belik Member Posts: 397 Seasoned Practitioner WiFi Icon
    edited January 2020
    do you use constant speed or auto?

    we can try to create silent fan curve, like passive till 53C then 1000+2000 rpm till 61C then 1700+2200 etc
  • alisaeed
    alisaeed Member Posts: 24 Networker
    belik said:

    we can try to create silent fan curve, like passive till 53C then 1000+2000 rpm till 61C then 1700+2200 etc
    it's from temperature thresholds?
  • belik
    belik Member Posts: 397 Seasoned Practitioner WiFi Icon
    edited January 2020
    yep, NBFC reads CPU temp from normal real sensor
    so we can define depending on current real CPU temp which fake CPU temp to send to EC
    there is also third tab override fan speed, maybe use this one too
  • Tikisin
    Tikisin Member Posts: 22 Networker
    edited January 2020
    belik said:
    do you use constant speed or auto?

    we can try to create silent fan curve, like passive till 53C then 1000+2000 rpm till 61C then 1700+2200 etc
    What I've been doing is I leave the NBFC fan control service on enabled and put the fans on 0% target fan speed. After that I open the Predator Sense and there I am able to control both the CPU fan and the GPU fan a lot more precisely.
    For example, I control the CPU fan speed in increments of 60 and I've been usually placing it at 1320RPM as it is almost inaudible at all at that speed, whereas for the GPU fans it's a bit more troublesome because even though you can still regulate the speed in small increments, any speed lower than 960 RPM just goes down to 0 RPM, so I've been using it sometimes as 0 RPM and sometimes for testing purposes as 960RPM. 
    Even though it's not automatic it's quite convenient for me to be able to control the fans all the way. It's possible that you all knew this even before this comment but I just wanted to share in case someone didn't. 


  • alisaeed
    alisaeed Member Posts: 24 Networker
    I couldn't understand the override tap to be honest 

    But I have an issue with the max speed 
    When I set it to 100% it only run to 4000rpm,
    Is that normal? 
  • belik
    belik Member Posts: 397 Seasoned Practitioner WiFi Icon
    edited January 2020
    alisaeed said:
    I couldn't understand the override tap to be honest 

    But I have an issue with the max speed 
    When I set it to 100% it only run to 4000rpm,
    Is that normal? 
    It’s setup by the table above, you see that highest row is 90C Cpu and 3500+4000 rpm
    Instead of Cpu register, you can send temperature to gpu register (or send to both) and then it will be 92C gpu and 4500+5000 rpm

    if you set max rpm rpm in PredatorSense even with NBFC running, you must get 6000 rpm
  • belik
    belik Member Posts: 397 Seasoned Practitioner WiFi Icon
    edited January 2020
    Tikisin said:
    belik said:
    do you use constant speed or auto?

    we can try to create silent fan curve, like passive till 53C then 1000+2000 rpm till 61C then 1700+2200 etc
    What I've been doing is I leave the NBFC fan control service on enabled and put the fans on 0% target fan speed. After that I open the Predator Sense and there I am able to control both the CPU fan and the GPU fan a lot more precisely.
    For example, I control the CPU fan speed in increments of 60 and I've been usually placing it at 1320RPM as it is almost inaudible at all at that speed, whereas for the GPU fans it's a bit more troublesome because even though you can still regulate the speed in small increments, any speed lower than 960 RPM just goes down to 0 RPM, so I've been using it sometimes as 0 RPM and sometimes for testing purposes as 960RPM. 
    Even though it's not automatic it's quite convenient for me to be able to control the fans all the way. It's possible that you all knew this even before this comment but I just wanted to share in case someone didn't. 


    This is very interesting effect finally I know that minimal rpm on gpu aeroblade fan can be 1000 rpm not 2000  =)

    This is because there are two methods to control fans

    First, through EC using fan curve table, this method used in mode Auto in PredatorSense and also when you check coolboost (shift fan level by 2 rows), overclock profile Fast (+1 row), profile Extreme (+2 row). NBFC uses it too.

    Another method is custom speed in PredatorSense and turbo button (set to max). Latest two options work directly bypassing EC, they not use fan curve table. But also those custom speed option checks the current temperature and doesn’t allow to set rpm less than allowed by the table. So when NBFC sends temp 21 C to EC, custom speed sees it and lowers minimal allowed rpm. So you are able to set minimal speed which fan can support physically.

    Which minimal rpm you can set on cpu and gpu fans?

  • belik
    belik Member Posts: 397 Seasoned Practitioner WiFi Icon
    edited January 2020
    I got the answer from moderator of this community that sorry they can’t help, try to ask Acer support  :o

    So on top of awful poorly designed cooling system with horrible aerodynamic they made awful software control and on top of it their support is zero, useless

    Community is great though  :)
  • Stuont
    Stuont Member Posts: 17 Troubleshooter
    edited January 2020
    Great work, belik

    I tried changing fan speed register in EC before you posted solution, no luck :)
    Great idea with temperature register in EC.
    Your config for NBFC works fine.

    I doubt that support will provide info on manual EC control enabling.
    But at least working solution is great, it's possible to create custom fan curve even without manual EC control.
  • belik
    belik Member Posts: 397 Seasoned Practitioner WiFi Icon
    Stuont said:
    Great work, belik

    I tried changing fan speed register in EC before you posted solution, no luck :)
    Great idea with temperature register in EC.
    Your config for NBFC works fine.

    I doubt that support will provide info on manual EC control enabling.
    But at least working solution is great, it's possible to create custom fan curve even without manual EC control.
    Yep speed registers or speed shift are overwritten immediately I wonder why temperature is not

    What I don’t like in the solution above is very high poll interval, 100 ms instead of 3000 ms

    And even with this interval sometime EC can write its value, if you set 0 rpm in full silence can you here periodically that fan try to start?
  • Stuont
    Stuont Member Posts: 17 Troubleshooter
    belik said:
    And even with this interval sometime EC can write its value, if you set 0 rpm in full silence can you here periodically that fan try to start?
    I haven't noticed fans start during brief testing, though I have hdd so it's possible fans start can't be heard because of hdd noise

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